Author Topic: Got some money, now for a mod!!! But which one?  (Read 4833 times)

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spencerjw

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Got some money, now for a mod!!! But which one?
« on: January 31, 2004, 06:35:32 PM »
For the price, which mod is the first I should do?  I've got the money set aside for a chip, but should that be what I do first?  Would exhaust be better?

I'm *really* leaning towards a chip.  So the real question is, where do I get it from and how long will it take?  If I need to get a spare ECU I think I can afford that too, but if I can get it done locally all the better.

So, what's the definitive answer?  Where and how much is it going to cost me?

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jayryan

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Got some money, now for a mod!!! But which one?
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2004, 07:21:10 PM »
Hehe...I got my suspension done first and have no regrets. I can still have tons of fun without the chip. If I got the chip and my car handled crappy...well then...yeah. Anyway.
As far as chips go....they're all about the same. APR has a local shop here and is about $400 or so and you could do it during your lunch. I think when the time comes, I'm going to go Neuspeed. I'll have to send my ECU in, but it'll only cost $200. They both give the same performance, but APR has more options.

There's my two sense...
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Got some money, now for a mod!!! But which one?
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2004, 07:21:10 PM »

spencerjw

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« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2004, 11:02:58 PM »
Anyone else have 2 more centcs on this topic?  Not that your 2 didn't make a difference....
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DenverPat

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Got some money, now for a mod!!! But which one?
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2004, 11:59:55 PM »
I'm not really sure there's a huge difference in chips.  A 1 Bar Neuspeed should act similar to a 1 Bar APR to a 1 Bar GIAC.  There are subtle performance differences, but nothing you could tell from your butt-dyno unless you have a LOT of experience (even then maybe not).  Anyway, I also wanted a local guy so I had a resource I could work with face to face in case of any problems.  I haven't had any problems, but like knowing he's there if I do.  I went to Champagne Motorsports (Larry) on Broadway.  However, he's probably the most expensive around. ($650?)
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RobD

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« Reply #4 on: February 01, 2004, 01:35:37 AM »
Pat you should probably let Spence know you went the upgraded route since you have a KO4 turbo and needed programming tuned to that.  I'm guessing that and the brand you went with (MTM?) is why it was 650.  I could be all wrong but I seem to remember some conversation leaning that direction when we were at Wash park this past fall.

Anyway I would go with suspension then chip for the same reason JR listed.  The stock suspension on the B5 is notorious for it's floating body rolling springs.  Upgrade the suspension and you'll feel much more confident in the turns and at speed.  Depending on the rubber situation you might make sure you you have good adhesion too.  

I love my chip(APR) and am very happy with it.  APR comes highly recommended but I would have gone with whatever I could have scored a good deal on.  Wett/upsolute/Revo/Nuespeed/Giac all seem to do a nice job extracting that extra power from the 1.8t.

Good luck with your decision and don't forget to keep us posted of what you decide.

Check out the forum section of Clubb5.com to find a deal or two.

Rob

DenverPat

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« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2004, 02:30:18 AM »
Rob wrote, "
Pat you should probably let Spence know you went the upgraded route since you have a KO4 turbo and needed programming tuned to that. I'm guessing that and the brand you went with (MTM?) is why it was 650. I could be all wrong but I seem to remember some conversation leaning that direction when we were at Wash park this past fall."


Yeah Spence, I originally just had a chip.  That was my first mod.  I eventually blew up my turbo at 105K miles and ended up replacing it with a K04.  Since I new I was pushing more air and had an aftermarket exhaust, I knew I could go with a more agressive chip, so Larry exchanged my MTM stage 1 chip with an MTM stage 2 chip for $100.  If I were to get a couple other new parts, I'm sure he'd do the same thing for the stage 3 MTM software.  MTM runs their stages a little bit differently (and better in my opinion) than most others out there.  Again, it's more money, so it's by no means a no-brainer.  Feel free to give me a call to discuss this, as I'm going to be soon and don't want to write it all out.
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That said, I'm very satisfied with the route I went.
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kt037

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Got some money, now for a mod!!! But which one?
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2004, 06:38:07 AM »
my first mods ar always wheels and suspention...pretty first, then fast next!
OT DISH?-----> nope!
and YES I KNOW I CAN NOT SEPLL!!!!

RobD

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« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2004, 02:19:23 PM »
What's speed if you cannot control it throught the turns and oh it looks pretty too with the 4x4 wheel gap gone.

jayryan

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« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2004, 04:06:20 PM »
I agree with Rob. Because of my upgrade in suspension. I can now take full advantage of my unchipped engine. I would go with a chip now though if I could justify it and then do more suspension work to take full advantage of that.
However, Mike has a great point. My car looks very nice and I spent a chip's worth of money making it so. So there is something to be said for looks. But I'm done with that for now unless is really cheap.
Pat's car...? His car is definately set up to handle a K04. There's nothing like a nice speedy powerslide in an AWD....hehe :P
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RobD

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« Reply #9 on: February 01, 2004, 04:08:36 PM »
Quote from: "TLJR20v"
I agree with Rob.


You can't agree with me because I agreed with you first! :)

kt037

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« Reply #10 on: February 01, 2004, 09:05:23 PM »
Quote from: "RobD"
Quote from: "TLJR20v"
I agree with Rob.


You can't agree with me because I agreed with you first! :)

 oh yeah... you can't agree with me, it is not permitted!


dude go for threaded body/ damping adj-coilovers OR a spring and adj koni/or grooved bilstein combo.

those are youre 2 best bets for a 1st mod

here is what i did
1. springs
2. extreme almost-fitting wheels (not really recomended, unless your crazy like me)
3. had to buy coilovers to where my wheels
4. had to buy bumpstops made out of hockey pucks to keep the back from rubbing
5. did the infamous broken timing belt mod
hehe
OT DISH?-----> nope!
and YES I KNOW I CAN NOT SEPLL!!!!

spencerjw

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Got some money, now for a mod!!! But which one?
« Reply #11 on: February 02, 2004, 12:09:07 PM »
Quote from: "kt037"
dude go for threaded body/ damping adj-coilovers OR a spring and adj koni/or grooved bilstein combo.

those are youre 2 best bets for a 1st mod

here is what i did
1. springs


What kind of pricing am I looking at with a spring upgrade vs. a chip upgrade?  I've really only got about $500 or so to play with this round.
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shummer

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Got some money, now for a mod!!! But which one?
« Reply #12 on: February 02, 2004, 02:09:43 PM »
You should be able to get both springs and shocks for about $500. I went with used Eibach springs ($100) and new Bilstein Sport shocks (~$350 IIRC). Purchased both from clubb5.com classifieds.

I believe this was the order of my mods:

1. chip
2. suspension
3. tie bar
4. 17" wheels + tires
5. brakes

The chip definitely increased the fun factor. I mainly did the suspension for the looks and never comprehended the performance aspect of it until taking it out to the track. The suspension arguably makes a bigger difference than the chip, albeit less fun. Also, few bystanders will enjoy the stiffer ride.

I went with an APR chip through a vwvortex group buy way back when. I went with APR based on Boris's and Chas's recommendation. I'm pretty sure it was around $600-$700, but I got everything: stock, chipped, race, and valet programs, error code erase, throttle body alignment, and security code lockout. It took APR quite some time to setup a distributor in CO so that's nice now, but it did not stop me from mailing in my ECU.

spencerjw

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Got some money, now for a mod!!! But which one?
« Reply #13 on: February 02, 2004, 02:22:29 PM »
Quote from: "shummer"
It took APR quite some time to setup a distributor in CO so that's nice now, but it did not stop me from mailing in my ECU.


I think that I just realized you edited your post.

Anyway, which distributor do they have in Colorado now?
pencer
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spencerjw

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« Reply #14 on: February 02, 2004, 02:45:39 PM »
I talked to the dictributor in Broomfield (Auto Sports Werks), I might just head up there this afternoon and get this installed today.  For my '04 it's $499 + $23 for a half hour install.  A bit more than I had wanted to spend but I don't see much in the means of an alternative.
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92UrS4

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Got some money, now for a mod!!! But which one?
« Reply #15 on: February 02, 2004, 03:28:25 PM »
Well if you have some extra scratch and you want Neuspeed springs check out this Group Buy over at Clubb5.com.  Pretty sweet deal:

http://www.clubb5.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=65564

spencerjw

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« Reply #16 on: February 02, 2004, 03:49:17 PM »
Quote from: "gietl"
Well if you have some extra scratch and you want Neuspeed springs check out this Group Buy over at Clubb5.com.  Pretty sweet deal:

http://www.clubb5.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=65564


I just posted about the GB, can you answer any of the questions that I asked there?
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92UrS4

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« Reply #17 on: February 02, 2004, 04:25:32 PM »
We can do the install as a garage day.  We have done a handful of spring installs and the expertise in the area seems to be growing.

I believe the group buy is ending today on that deal.

Many will recommend shocks because as long as we are doing the front end, which is a pain, might as well do shocks.  However, your car is brand spankin new and in all honestly I think you'll be fine on the stock shocks for a little while.  They may wear out faster.

For what it's worth, I run Eibach Sport springs with stock shocks and have been very happy, though probably this summer I will need to replace my shocks.  I will be past 40K and I am noticing some softness. So there are really no other mods needing to be done in order to install the springs.

spencerjw

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Got some money, now for a mod!!! But which one?
« Reply #18 on: February 02, 2004, 06:35:12 PM »
Good to know, not sure if I can really afford it now though.

Just got back from AutoSport Werks, had the APR Chip installed.  Noticable difference in turbo sound, but haven't done much street driving so really havn;t noticed the performance increases yet.  It's all highway from Broomfield to Parker.... Ended up costing $580 after labor and tax.
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« Reply #19 on: February 02, 2004, 06:38:56 PM »
Keep in mind your car will also have to re-learn your driving habits.  So after a little while it should be even better.   Welcome to the chipped club.

You will find rather quickly that you want a suspension upgrade and a lower tie bar to tighten up that front end and reduce the body roll.  With the chip you will finn yourself moving around a lot quicker.

Another thing to note, you'll probably end up lighting em up at the lights until you adjust to the new sensitivity of the accelerator ;)  At least i had that problem for about a month.

spencerjw

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« Reply #20 on: February 03, 2004, 02:23:36 AM »
Well, I do now notice a difference, but I am a bit hesitent to really open her up, should I be?

Well, I did this evening.  I floored it all the way through 2nd gear till it shifted (tiptronic auto here remember) to third (red lined almost in first and second).  After it shifted to third I let up on the gas and it hung there for about 2 seconds, then went to 4th and finally to 5th as usual.  The hang before going to 4th was a bit odd feeling, but I'd assume that's the computer holding it there in case I need to hit it again.  Just anticipating my next move essentially.  But, about 100 feet after it shifted to 5th (Overdrive basically) the engine light came on.  Oops, that can't be good.  Nothing seemed wrong with the car and it still drove perfectly normal.  I called the shop and he said as long as it seems to drive ok to not worry about it too much but that when I have time I should either come up (they're in Broomfield, I'm in Parker) or find someone (not a dealership of course) that has a VAG-COM to diagnose the engile fault.

So, to make a short story long....
Anyone in the area have a VAG-COM that oculd give me a hand with this?

Thanks a ton,
Spencer
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RobD

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« Reply #21 on: February 03, 2004, 02:47:50 AM »
Spence - Congratulation on the chip!  I'm sure you find it to be a great addition to your ride.  

As far as vag com goes, Winston, JR and Randy have the partial version (not registered) but that allows you to read the fault codes.  Then Chas has the full version.  

Chas did you get it working properly? Tip mod into sport mode should be part of the TB gtg if it is fully working.

Not sure what could be causing the cel to come on but keep us posted.

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« Reply #22 on: February 03, 2004, 02:15:32 PM »
Hey Spencer, congratulations on the APR chip!  I have an Upsolute, but if I had it to do again, I would get the APR or GIAC.

It really is a toss-up on Chip vs. Suspension, but with it being winter, I think you made the right choice.  You will be ready for a new suspension after winter has gone away.

Jay was right, we can definitely help you get the suspension in.  We've done a ton of them (15+) and have the process dialed in.  You'll want to get an alignment within a week or so of the install to make sure you are up to spec, but it will be close.

As far as the hesitation, you may need to get the "tip chip" as well to speed up your shifting.

If you want to stop by my place on the 21st (I think that is where we settled on doing the timing belt garage day) I can clear that for you and diagnose the code.  

Also, keep in mind that with the newly added horsepower, you are going to find the weakest link in your vaccum system.  You will probably need to get the Audi TT DV (diverter valve or bypass valve) for around $30 and maybe change our your vaccum hoses $5-10.

Now get out there and have fun!
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spencerjw

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« Reply #23 on: February 03, 2004, 02:37:14 PM »
Thanks guys, I'll really try to make it to the GTG.  I'll just have to see how she runs over the next few days, anything I should be werry of or watch for in the beginning?
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jayryan

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« Reply #24 on: February 03, 2004, 02:58:20 PM »
As Winston so rightly suggested, change that DV. I picked up an EVO off ebay for a bit more than the TT...but that's me. I'm always spending more money than I should...maybe mine'll work better than the TT DV...one can only hope (yes, I do have buyer's remorse).

Anyway....

My DV's failing I think. I've got noise around 3K RPM and I'm surging with inconsistent boost. Aside from the turbo, it's the only thing I've not changed out. I'm doing that at the TB GTG as well.

So...

Another two or three bits from a guy who's learned everything he knows from this stupid car club...money spending encourager people... :P

BTW...I've got the Neuspeed Sports...They are awesome. In fact, I think eurosportacc.com has a set on clearance. I bought mine from them on clearance, they're great guys.
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« Reply #25 on: February 03, 2004, 03:30:44 PM »
Yes, you will notice some fluttering or hesitation (more than normal turbo lag) when your DV fails.  The poor spring in there just is not strong enough to handle 200hp.
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